Learn to Self-Publish an eBook
Tim Lewis: Andrew and Pete are two very quirky and individual marketers from Newcastle in England. However, I’ve seen them speak so many times and they are just really fantastic speakers and genuinely nice people, and I have got to know them quite well over the last few years at the conferences.
Tim Lewis: This episode, as you will probably discover, isn’t entirely the most serious, so if you want serious deadpan usual episodes then this probably isn’t the one for you. However, I think that even though we are slightly merry in the Christmas spirit, I don’t think there was actually any Christmas spirit consumed, because it was quite early in the morning, but it is actually an interview that you can draw a lot of lessons from. I think the points that Andrew and Pete make about content marketing in general are very good, and I think with their slightly jocular manner, that I also share a times, it can get lost, but actually there is an awful lot to be said for making your content as remarkable as possible.
Tim Lewis: So, now over the interview.
Tim Lewis: Merry Christmas Andrew and Pete.
Pete: Merry Christmas!
Andrew: Merry Christmas, Tim!
Pete: Did you have a nice Christmas Tim?
Andrew: Was Santa good? Were you on the good list?
Tim Lewis: Oh yes, the Christmas that actually hasn’t happened yet when we’re recording, was fantastic!
Andrew: Tim, don’t ruin the Christmas special. It is definitely not the 8th of December when we’re recording this.
Pete: No. Don’t ruin the illusion.
Tim Lewis: Well, I heard that you guys were actually busy collecting reindeer for Santa the other day.
Pete: We’ve gone off reindeer.
Andrew: We’ve gone off reindeer.
Tim Lewis: Yeah.
Pete: We went to visit some reindeer to give them some food, to feed the reindeer with our friends, and we got attacked. We got ambushed by the deer. He completely took us out. We were in park.
Andrew: We must have been about 30 seconds in this park before one of our friends got charged from behind, from this massive reindeer with huge antlers. It just like … took her out. This is a park where they’ll let kids go in and feed reindeer.
Pete: It’s dangerous!
Andrew: Rudolph you are not friendly and we’re just going to stick to building snowmen.
Pete: The worst thing was we didn’t even know that our friend had been charged. We just thought she’d fallen over in the mud.
Andrew: We were just pointing and laughing basically.
Tim Lewis: You guys obviously live in Lapland then because it’s not Newcastle as claimed previously. Anyway I shall get on with the questions that I originally wrote down for this interview, which is the first one, which obviously should come as surprise the questions before at all or anything.
Tim Lewis: When did you realise that the average blog content wasn’t getting you anywhere? Was it when you were attacked by reindeer or was it some other time.
Andrew: I feel like that should be our dates now. It’s like B.R., Before Reindeers.
Pete: Before Reindeers.
Going from Average to Special
Andrew: Probably about three years B.R. Around 2014 we had probably been … We set up our business straight out of university so this was back in 2011. We done the thing that all marketers tell you just start creating content. We started creating content. We were blogging and we were tweeting and we were doing LinkedIn. We were literally just getting nothing from it at all. Like nothing. It was just radio silence on everything we were putting out there.
Andrew: What was getting us a tonne of business was our local networking. When we went local networking we were just dominated. We built up this local audience pretty quickly. We looked at why we did so well networking and not so well online. It’s because our online profile we were definitely just trying to be someone else. We were trying to be corporate marketers just like all the other marketing companies in our area. When we went networking we had some fun with it, didn’t we?
Pete: We went networking. We didn’t just do what everyone else did. We took chocolate. We threw chocolate about. We took party poppers. We took indoor fireworks. We even dressed up as a zombie and got business from that. We built up this huge reputation and people knew us before we even went to a networking event. We’d built up this proceeding reputation, which is great! People were talking about us. We were getting noticed and we were wiping the floor out. We were getting all the business.
Pete: It was great but we were really frustrated because our online content just wasn’t. I think it is because we were putting up this old-fashioned look. It just wasn’t us at all, right? In doing that we were also just behind everyone else. We are ten years behind all these other marketing companies or companies that have been blogging for five years or ten years. We thought we need to switch this up. Why don’t we take what we were doing off line and do that online?
Pete: That’s what we did. We started to make our content much, much, more interesting, entertaining, fun. Include more personality, include more of ourselves in the brand and the content. It was an instant switch. Instantly we started getting more subscribers. Instantly we started getting more comments, more shares, more kind of what you would call fans who start to just share everything you put out there and there was this massive switch a light bulb moment as it were. We were just like, “Oh my God! This is incredible! This is amazing!”
Pete: Ever since then we’ve just been maxing that out and trying to focus more and more and more on what makes us unique. Why would people share our content? I think that’s a really important message for everyone else out there. If you’re hitting your head against the wall, putting other content out there and it’s not really doing much for you can you actually make it a little bit more interesting, more valuable, more entertaining, more inspiring, more awe worthy. Instantly you will get more results.
Pete: We get told all the time by other marketers that content marketing is this long-term strategy and we think, “Yeah but the longer you do, the more results you’re going to get but if you’re not getting results immediately in engagement or subscribers or comments from people saying how much they enjoy your content then you’re not doing it to your fullest potential yet. There’s a lot of scrub to improve.
Tim Lewis: The obvious question that people are going to come back to is how are you going to incorporate your reindeer strategy moving forward?
Andrew: I thought that was going to be a serious question there, Tim. I’m slightly disappointed in you. I don’t know. I’m feeling it. Well, we’ve got reindeer antlers on our website at the moment on our log on.
Pete: Yes we do.
Andrew: We do. Maybe we just start every interview with the reindeer story from now on.
Tim Lewis: Yeah. When Park Howell he was saying about the importance of stories. That’s your … Your key story is the reindeer gate story where you’re basically seeing all your friends knocked down by reindeer and you were just laughing until they turned on you.
Andrew: Yeah. As soon as you said that I thought, “What the hell was Park Howell talking about reindeer for?”
Tim Lewis: I had to shut him up. I had to cut out all the bits that Park Howell was talking about reindeer. He’s just obsessed with reindeer!
What Makes Content Shareable?
Tim Lewis: Another serious question then. I like the way that Pete said before the show that you could either give a very short answer or a very long answer for this but what makes content really great and shareable?
Andrew: I love how you answered him with can we have a medium sized answer please?
Pete: Yeah. Okay … when it comes to making great content there’s five things that you need to do that are really, really, important. Now content can be tough but it can also be a really fun and easy and amazing thing to do. When we like to create content we like to make it shareable because if you can make your content more shareable your audience is going to grow so much quicker, okay? That’s what everyone wants. They want to get quicker success. They want to grow faster. The more subscribers you get, the more opportunity, the more people you have to sell to. This is what we all want from our content.
Pete: There’s five things that make people share. The first thing is brand advocacy. People will literally just share your stuff because they like you. They trust you. They’re a fan of what you do and they want to support you. That is what we mean by having a fan and that’s really important. Whenever we put content out there … I’m using air quotations here … Our fans, they’re going to just share it. They might not even watch it. That’s really cool.
Andrew: Two ways to do that through your content. The first is try to put a little bit more of you into it. Maybe you can be a little bit of a rebel, maybe you can talk about what hasn’t work or maybe you can like allow people to resonate with you and your story.
Andrew: The second thing is to stop waiting for fans. Stop waiting for people to come and find your stuff. Go out and find people. This is what we did especially when we did a lot more … When we ramped up our online strategy. We didn’t wait for people to come and find our Twitter profiles or our YouTube videos or our LinkedIn profiles. We went out and find other people. We commented on their stuff. We made the first move. As soon as you make the first move, when they see your stuff come up, they’re much more likely to hit that share button.
Pete: Awesome. That is the first one. Brand advocacy. The second one is emotion. If you can move people than you can inspire them and move them to share your content. Okay. When we talk about emotion you might just instantly trigger off things like happy or sad but actually there’s lots of different emotions to tuck into. It’s the more extreme emotions that do better. For example, you’ve got joy, shock, or humour is a great one, it’s under-utilised but it’s not the only one. You’ve even got nostalgia. Nostalgia’s great if you can remind people of past experiences and time then they’re going to want to share that because that’s a part of their life that they remember. That’s special to them.
Pete: What we see is it’s the more high arousal that make people share the most. Something that has you laughing slightly or gives you a slight chuckle isn’t going to make you share something as much as something that has you rolling on the floor laughing. Try to add in emotion to your content and trying to make it a little bit more extreme or high arousal.
Tim Lewis: I think you have another three letters to go.
Andrew: Oh, okay.
Andrew: The next thing is appearance. This isn’t necessarily more appearance but this is the appearance of people who are going to be sharing your content. Right? A lot of people create content for selfish reasons, to make them look good or they want to sell their products. We always think what does it mean for someone to share this and what does it say about them? Even if you’re not in the business world whatever somebody shares something on their own social profiles it’s saying something about them. Everyone’s creating a personal brand even though most people don’t know what a personal brand even is. They know if they share this video it’s going to say something about them, their friends, and their family. Yeah?
Andrew: We’re always thinking about how do we content that allows other people to say something about them so that it doesn’t make them look funny or does it make them look in-the-know? It’s not necessarily always about, “Hey! Look how awesome Andrew and Pete are!”
Andrew: Are we rattling through these?
Pete: Is this sufficiently fast for you?
Tim Lewis: I don’t know. Well, you haven’t actually … Usually one these I’ve seen you speak enough times to know that this is actually spelling an acronym but you haven’t even mentioned the acronym yet, which I’m a bit disappointed by.
Pete: We were waiting for the big reveal.
Andrew: You’ve gone and ruined it, Tim.
Pete: Here’s Tim and that. We’ve got at the moment the A. I wonder what word we’re spelling. I can’t … The next one is C. Add the letter of C. For causes and believes. If you can align your brand to something that people will feel passionate about, a cause, a belief, a charity, or maybe just even just a really strong passion, then you hold the power to be shared as well. When you talk about something that means a lot to other people they’re going to want to share it because they want that message to be spread to. As part of that your brand is going to be aligned with it and be shared as well. Not every business can tap into this but you can do it to a degree for every business.
Andrew: Even like … you can almost air on the tiny bit controversial side here. I don’t know if you saw recently Pete Sam crusade on LinkedIn where he was talking about is it okay to smoke in meetings? Did you see that? It blew it something as trivial and silly as that because people have a real passion, a real opinion. If you can tap into people’s opinions as well great ways to be shared, yeah? Now we’re ready for the big reveal then? We’ve got Brand Advocacy, Emotion, Appearance, Causes and Beliefs, and the final one is H for High Value.
Andrew: Now we want to challenge you on this because we know you’ve probably heard marketers like us talk about creating high value content since the word marketing was invented. I don’t think people really push themselves enough to create high value content. The thing is content marketing isn’t novel anymore. No matter what niche you’re in it’s probably crowded already or there’s other people creating content around what you’re going to be creating content on.
Andrew: A lot of people, especially when they’re doing their own content, they’ll just kind of do something to get it publish. They won’t push themselves to create content that’s as awesome as possible. What we like to say is, “Don’t think that you’re creating content for your own platform. Think about if you were creating content for someone else who has a huge audience. Maybe like the biggest industry leader in publication in your industry. How much effort would you put in if you were creating content for them? That’s how much effort you need to put into your own content.”
Andrew: We learned this the hard way when we got to write for Social Media Examiner, which is huge in the marketing industry we put so much effort into that. We researched. We created gifts. We wrote a tonne like a tonne and cut loads out. Checked it over loads of times. Sent it off to them. Wanted to make sure it was amazing and that article went down so, so, well. It got shared a tonne. Then we thought, “Hang on! We’ve just spent the best part of a day or more writing that one piece for them. Why are we spending and hour and a half tops on our own stuff?” Yeah.
Andrew: We really want to push you. When we say create high value content I’m really creating high value content.
Tim Lewis: Are you now spending a day and a half on each piece of content you’re producing or you just decided to do everything an hour and a half for everybody?
Andrew: That’s a great question.
Pete: We push ourselves. That was one of the reasons why we started doing more video. Typically, work would take us half an hour to write. Then prepping it … maybe and hour or two max. With video, it takes just maybe four hours if we’re editing it by ourselves.
Andrew: Yeah. We started outsourcing a lot of the tasks around our content creation so we can actually put more into to actually making it as good as possible in the first initial stages. That’s worked really well for us. Yeah. Well we’re always pushing ourselves so even yesterday we’re looking at our content and we’re thinking, “Is this good enough? Could we push ourselves even more?” Going into 2018 we’re constantly looking at how we’re actually upping ourselves, upping our game. We’re not just staying the same.
Pete: Yeah. Expect more value and more awesomeness in 2018 mine you.
Tim Lewis: And you’ll be properly on the beach so to speak.
Andrew: Yeah. Oh, we didn’t reveal the acronym.
Pete: I was just about to.
Andrew: This is the most underwhelming reveal we’ve ever done of this acronym.
Tim Lewis: No. I’ve seen you do it alright as well.
Life’s a Beach
Pete: So for those of you that can’t spell, that word is … BEACH. You just need to sound it out. If you sound it … like we said before content is tough. Well not only is content tough but it’s a beach Now if you say that it sounds a bit rude like life’s a beach. This is the clean version, right?
Tim Lewis: Well there’s nothing wrong with the word beach.
Pete: Content beach. The beach is obviously the acronym for the witch … the reasons why people share. Big reveal.
Andrew: Can we have some sound effects at that point please, Tim?
Tim Lewis: Yeah. Probably not. Depends on the budget. Beach isn’t really … So.
Andrew: Tim, you need to push your boundaries. High value. Come on. There’s nothing high value there-
Tim Lewis: You’ll be asking me to use the effects for my podcasting in a minute. I don’t know.
Andrew: Are we still drunk from Christmas? I don’t know.
Tim Lewis: Yeah but it’s all about-
Andrew: How are you … You probably use Christmas has actually gone already.
Andrew: Christmas has happened.
Talking Brussels Sprouts
Tim Lewis: Yeah. I mean … One of the things about Christmas that we’ve obviously just gone through and it’s a big talking point each year is Brussels sprouts. They are a controversial thing because they are part of the Christmas tradition but people don’t like Brussels sprouts in general. They don’t think they’re the nicest things to eat as a side dish. I presume they have them in the U.S. If not well they won’t know what this sections of the shows about at all.
Tim Lewis: Let’s say as a practical example the people from The National Brussels Sprouts Corporation come into your office and say, “Help us Andrew and Pete! We really need help with our content. We really want help to make our content much more aligned with your beach principles.” How would you work with The National Brussels Sprouts Corporation to help them with their content? What sort of ideas would you give them and how would you go about the process in practises actually applying these principles.
Pete: There’s two ways to look at this, right? I can give you the proper answer and the jokey answer here. Tell us about the jokey answer. The thing about brussels sprouts is just for Christmas they’re very seasonal based. That’s something that maybe we want to get away from if we want to increase those sales over the year. Okay? Maybe I would start to tie in brussels Sprouts to other season, right? Because brussels sprouts aren’t just for Christmas.
Andrew: I didn’t think Brussels sprouts were even a Christmas thing.
Pete: Yeah. Absolutely.
Andrew: You don’t get brussels sprouts at your-
Pete: Also … Yeah. I mean you can get them all year round maybe but you never really buy them until it’s Christmas.
Andrew: … I’ve never. I feel like that’s why I’m-
Tim Lewis: Do you steal them then?
Pete: We only buy them at … We only buy-
Andrew: I grow them. I’ll go with that.
Pete: … Yeah. I would tie it into other holiday seasons or just more in general like eat them all year round.
Tim Lewis: Like nothing says you love your partner on Valentine’s Day than to give them brussels sprouts?
Pete: Exactly! Stay single this year with brussels sprouts. The more serious answer is where we usually work with all of our clients we start to work out first what people’s brand values are. What their mission is and who their audience is. Okay? From that we start to get a general idea of what type of content we should be producing. Then we try to look at ways to make that content shareable and we look at ways of delivering that content that’s maybe a little bit not in the normal. It’s got a bit of twist to it.
Andrew: We also talk about content rich versus content poor industries. A content rich industries are where you can talk about what you can actually do and people are going to find it interesting. Yeah? I think marketers have it easy in that a lot of issues that pop out when we’re talking about content marketing. We can talk about marketing all day long and people are want to know about marketing because they can grow their business.
Andrew: A lot of industries they can’t really talk about what they do with just really boring people, which I would probably say is the brussels sprout industry. If you’re in the brussels sprout industry you can’t really talk all that much about how awesome brussels sprouts are. You’ve got to find something else that aligns with your audience and what their problems are or how they want to be entertained and create content around that instead.
Pete: Yeah. For example the obvious choice … You could go with two different ways of doing this but the obvious choice here would be to create brussels sprout recipe videos. Recipes that have brussels sprouts in them, that people can make throughout the year. Okay? You could talk about the benefits of brussels sprouts, the health benefit stuff. They’re particularly good for you. There better ways to cook them.
Andrew: That sounds like the worst take in the world.
Pete: It does sound a bit boring but then what you could also do is just go for the full on entertainment, right? Because it’s not something that people necessarily want to know about but people always want to be entertained.
Andrew: You know what Brussels sprouts … I’ve got it. I think the Brussels sprouts website brusselssprouts.com needs to just teach people how to be cool and that’s all it does.
Andrew: Because that’s what Brussels sprouts are. Brussels sprouts are not the coolest vegetable by a long shot but they’re cool once a year. Yeah? Christmas. I feel like the Brussels sprouts blog should just teach people how to embrace their geekiness or their hate and turn that into a positive. It’s almost like a good news, positive, very uplifting, Brussels sprouts blog. Say that with a straight face.
Pete: Alternatively it should be a blog all about farts. Inappropriate farting.
Pete: I’m only saying that because that is hilarious!
Andrew: What about a fart website where you can like press each Brussels sprouts like buttons and it gives you a different noise.
Tim Lewis: Yeah. I think you’re going just purely for people to eat brussels sprouts to get flatulent now. It’s probably quite a small part of their target audience. Maybe up north that’s kind of a … That’s what you think. It’s like, “I’ve got a bit of a with not farting enough so I’m going to eat some brussels sprouts.”
Andrew: The riches are in the niches.
Working out your target audience
Tim Lewis: Back to the serious stuff slightly. You were saying about like you identify your target audience and what they want. Let’s say the guy from Brussels sprouts corporations says, “Well I’ve no idea really who my target audience is.” How would you tell them to work out how their target audience? What sort of tools and techniques would you say to the guy from the Brussels sprouts corporation as to how to work out who his target audience is?
Pete: That’s a good question. There’s lot of things you can do. As part of the whole fast-moving consumer goods industry you can probably get a lot of stats from the actual stores as well. They know everything about you and your buying habits. For the general everyday person there’s things you can do. You can do qualitive and quantitative research. U can actually interview people that have brought from here in the past or potential customers to find out what they want, what their habits are. You can use things like your Facebook insights and analytics. You can find out on their by demographics. You can even do a general, broad, ad on Facebook about your topic and within the stats of that, you can figure out whose actually engaging with that message the most. It will tell you things like age, location, gender, interests, and things like this. You can then start to narrow that down into who is actually engage with your content or your product and go from there.
Pete: You can also do the same with analytics on any other platform like Google analytics, Twitters analytics, YouTube analytics. We actually found out a lot from this kind of stuff. What’s also interesting is figuring out what the difference is between the people who are watching the content but who’s actually buying your stuff. For us that’s actually quite different. We have maybe the people buying our stuff may be slightly … maybe middle aged women? Like a lot of people buy our stuff and the majority of people watching our content is slightly younger men, which is interesting.
Andrew: It’s your good looks
Pete: Yeah. Must be.
Andrew: That gets them buying.
Pete: And did you get that really sexy picture of me on the landing page?
Pete: Might put of the guys.
Andrew: For guys watching we’ve sorry.
Tim Lewis: Because as I discovered before the show Pete actually drinks his own urine so that’s probably attractive to some people.
Pete: Oh, my God! I do not.
Andrew: Not all year round. Just at Christmas.
Tim Lewis: Oh, but that year it was Berocca. One of those.
Pete: You’re going to start spreading rumours.
Tim Lewis: Well there’s a long history of people drinking their own urine who are successful. I’m not one of them. I’m not successful so … It’s going over.
Andrew: That’s the name of our new book.
Pete: Maybe not drinking enough, Tim.
The History of Corrugated Iron as promoted by Andrew and Pete
Tim Lewis: Yeah. Anyway I have another worked example for you to work through. It’s another … This time I’m having a book example so let’s say to you that somebody … so we called them Ali Brown, came into your office and said they had just written their book, A History of Corrugated Iron. How would you go about applying the same principles you talked to The brussels Sprouts corporation who has written this absolutely massive tome on the history of corrugate iron. How would you go about helping them to create good content for that?
Andrew: I would just say, “Let’s start again.” Let’s re-evaluate our life goals. Step one. Alright. Serious answer. Corrugate iron? There must be an audience for that.
Pete: It’s worth … First you need to think about the audience and what they want. Is it like people in the construction industry? Then you want to start thinking about what other problems they have, okay, that they might find this useful. Maybe you could give away like …
Andrew: Or is it the DIY industry?
Pete: Industry tips or DIY tips. Who would buy corrugated iron?
Pete: Upcyclers, maybe. There you go. You could do some cool content around upcycling. You could find the world’s greatest upcycling pieces.
Andrew: I would do a competition on the most beautiful corrugated iron in the world and the winner of that competition wins a trip-
Pete: To go and see some iron maiden turned into corrugated iron.
Andrew: … I was going to say a good night out.
Tim Lewis: I’m getting the feeling you wouldn’t give these people the respect they deserve when their coming to you. They’re just happy. Their whole lives work is writing this book about corrugated iron and you’re belittling their subject matter area.
Andrew: This isn’t a real book is it Tim? I’m starting to feel really guilty.
Pete: I know.
Tim Lewis: I know.
Andrew: I just got to let you know that I was like, “Hey, I was go and ask Andrew and Pete how I’d sell this new book.” We just completely like destroyed them just in time for Christmas.
Tim Lewis: Yeah. Well it’s a good thing that Christmas has already happened isn’t it? Okay. I think this …
Pete: Can we share some interesting facts about the history?
Tim Lewis: Yeah.
Pete: If there’s a full book of it then there must be some interesting facts that you can write about.
Andrew: There must be.
Tim Lewis: Yeah.
Andrew: Well I’m not!
Pete: This is the weirdest interview I’ve ever had.
Tim Lewis: It’s not the weirdest! I’m sure you’ve done … I’ve seen some of your podcasting interviews that are even stranger. They usually roll some sort of game show element in them at some point. I’ve not yet descended into doing a game show episode. Maybe next Christmas.
Pete: We’re still waiting for you to play with your sound effects box on your microphone.
Tim Lewis: Yeah. Well aside from … As I’ve told you in the pre-chat I’ve got this rolling sound voice transformer box. I can do things like increase my pitch. That’s not really done anything. Hang on. Is that making it … Yeah. I can make my voice a bit higher if I want to.
Andrew: Can you please say exterminate with that effect?
Tim Lewis: Exterminate! I can say, “Hello, Andrew and Pete! I’m here to tell you about my book The History of Corrugated Iron. Will you please tell me what I should do in terms of content?”
Andrew: Oh, my God!
Tim Lewis: I’ve always been too frightened to use that. The box on the live interview. I put a little bit of a radio effect on it but then I got the time-
Pete: You sound very professional.
Tim Lewis: Yeah. Let’s put the radio … This is the radio effect so I sound as poor as a normal radio broadcast.
Pete: You need to say something like, “Where can people find out about you, Andrew, and Pete? Over.” Roger that, Tim.
Tim Lewis: You know me enough by now. I don’t do what people tell me. Even though that is actually the next question I’ve got on here.
Andrew: We don’t get to tell people where to buy things. Definitely don’t ask that question.
Pete: Don’t ask us where people can find us.
Finding out about Andrew and Pete
Tim Lewis: Well I know where people can find you. They can go to Newcastle and knock on your door and … Because of course you’re not online at all or anything. Let’s say for some reasons one of the listeners thought, “I really like those guys because they talk about beaches and they talk about corporations and I’ve got this book about corrugated iron I really want to learn how to promote. How would these happy listeners find out about Andrew and Pete? Where are you online and what do you do? Have you got any books out? That’s the other question.
Andrew: Believe it or not we actually do this for a living. I promise you. We are pretty good at it I would like to think. You can find us at AndrewandPete.com. That’s where we create all of our content. That’s where our awesome membership site is. Where we’re working with small business owners to help grow their business with shareable, amazing, content. Our brand new book, Pete, is called-
Pete: Content Mavericks! Sorry. It’s our second book and it’s there to help you grow your business faster than ever with awesome, remarkable, content. It’s a seven step guide to take you through everything you need to do in order to create that remarkable content, get organised with it, get it out there, grow your audience, and actually generate some sales with it proactively. Not just sit there hoping that you’re going to get some sales.
Pete: I mean that’s really important because a lot of people are overwhelmed in this world of content marketing. Do I do Facebook ads right now. Do I write this content or do I make a video? What do I do with that video and then … Well I don’t know what I’m really about. What is my message? What do I want to be known about? You start to get a little overwhelmed and you don’t know where to start. That’s what the book is for. That’s also what our atomic membership site is also for.
Pete: But … That’s basically we like to do. We like to help people. Inspire them and help them to create more engaging content that going to actually work for their business in the short term as well as the long term.
Andrew: And enjoy it well they’re doing it.
Pete: Yeah and enjoy it because creating content should be fun. This is a fun interview.
Andrew: Mm-hmm (affirmative) That’s the word for it.
Pete: That’s our … A disaster! Another word for it is another word for it as well.
Tim Lewis: It was great to talk to you guys. Thanks very much for being on the show.
Pete: Thank you, Tim.
Andrew: Thank you so much, Tim, for having us!
Tim Lewis: Thanks guys! Merry Christmas!
Pete: Thanks for listening. I hope you had a great Christmas everyone.
If you liked this then you might like Episode 100 : She Doesn’t Just Wakeboard, She Interviews , How to reclaim your rights with Mark Schaefer and They Ask, You Answer for Fiction with Marcus Sheridan